GALACTICA

Yeah, liberal passion play through and through. I'm not usually a "Damn liberals!" type but this episode drew it out of me. It was also disturbing that they don't even really understand what racism is - it's just this nebulous thing awful people do, okay?

That nasty blond man is racist against our ill-defined creed which has material social consequences!

It's also nice that the writers were clearly too stupid to realize they should look at nationalism through the science fiction of the show by realizing how demographic ratios would be changed on doomsday. D'ya think these impoverished Amish analog Sagittarans would have been on jump-capable space boats on doomsday, hmm?
 

The sad thing about it Turkey is that the only way they could create their storyline was by having the Sagittarans betray what they believed and go to the doctor. In reality how do you think they would react when man's creation, Cylons, returned and pretty much wiped out humanity? I would think that that would harden their beliefs and make it unlikely that they would suddenly go see a doctor. Just so you know, the Amish do ride in cars. They just can't drive them.

Did we really have to have a Traitor centric episode? The child is a whiny incompetent. He strikes a superior officer, accuses a doctor without proof, and in general acts like a jerk. The only thing I can think of when I see him is how many people have died because of his actions. And can Adama make a decision anymore without later feeling remorse or apologizing?

Finally, Moore decides to stick his toe into some of the differences of the Colonies. The result though is a boring and predictable storyline. Turkey brings up the possibility for a good storyline. Of course, with the current group of writers, the result would be like this episode. I don't believe Moore has fleshed out any background on the different sets of Colonials, what they believe, or their history.

Is anyone else really bored by the whole talking Baltar/Six in my mind routine? The discussions are inane.

Zarek still shows the most sense of any character.
 

I associated the Sagittarons more closely with Scientologists, with their views of psychology instead being directed towards medicine in general. Especially because Athena's Cylon (Muslim) status was brought up repeatedly.

Even though I knew better, I still hoped against hope that Helo would turn out to be wrong. Especially after Dr. Cottle said he had performed an autopsy on the kid and found the medicine in his system. Helo can't always be right when he fights authority, and I was waiting for it to blow up in his face. He's not a doctor, and the boy's mother believes all doctors are evil. Unfortunately, this is still Battlestar Galactica as written by Ronald Moore.

We still see a lack of common sense in the show. Why would there be sectarian violence over Baltar? He has no supporters (He's not the same religion as 30% of the survivors who used to be in power or anything like that). Why do they respect the beliefs of the Sagittarons when they treaten to infect all humanity with a deadly virus, and the entire government thinks they are nuts? This is not survival mode - this is everyday liberal thinking stemming from a non-traumatized mind reacting to current events.
 

Why would there be sectarian violence over Baltar?

There are probably still a significant number of people that believe Baltar to be innocent and that he didn't have a choice in his actions. They will view a trial of Baltar as Rosalin simply trying to get rid of a political opponent. In the non-Moore reality, Baltar would have been pumped for information and then shoved out an airlock.

You just knew Helo would be right. It's probably because I'm not as nuanced as Moore. ;-)

This is not survival mode - this is everyday liberal thinking stemming from a non-traumatized mind reacting to current events.

My biggest gripe with the show from day one has been what you just pointed out. Moore doesn't seem to understand the situation humanity is facing. Instead he continues to trot out liberal cliches. Of course, from some of what I've seen on other forums, a lot of people are just as blind. A couple of weeks ago someone wrote that torturing Baltar wasn't called for since the humans weren't in a desperate situation. How can you deal with someone so willfully blind?
 

Why do you hate Helo?

I hope it isn't because he saved that female cylon from being raped and tortured.
 

This eppisode was not a pleaser...

I mean, what was the whole point of this eppisode? to show that people from Sagitaron are being treated as lower class citizens? i can see the comparison between america, Muslims etc.... But it was a really BAD comparison...

Helo? i am beggining to hate that guy more and more. I'd vote him the most annoying character in the series. I used to like like him, however he, out of all people tries to claim the "moral high ground". He's Fraked a Cylon, Killed her so she could get away to a base ship, endangering everyones lives, plus he's a total fag!

Please, i hope he's the character who leaves this season instead of starbuck!!!!
 

Once again, I think you're blinkered by your strange need to see every episode through the lens of American/Arab relations.

The closest analogue I can see to the Sagittarans would be Jehovah's Witnesses, who explicitly refuse blood transfusions out of an interpretation of Biblical scripture. (Another comparison might be Christian Scientists.)

I don't think Sagittarans are comporable to Muslims: their religion is clearly the same as the other Colonials, with more faith older and more technophobic traditions. The secular/traditionalist tension between the Caprican military and the Sagittarans zealots doesn't compare to the current situation, which has extremely religious people on either side.

Nevertheless, I aree with your main criticisms of the episode. It was a little much to stress the credibility of the doctor because of past history when we've never seen him before.

The refusal of the senior officers to listen to Helo was almost unbelievable; the only way I can rationalize it is that giving him the refugee management job really was a chump assignment done out of disrespect.

As well, with all the Sagittarian unrest, where the hell were all the other Sagittarans we've been introduced to? Dualla was there, sure. But where was Zarek? He was talking about Baltar-inspired unresst, but he didn't say a damn thing about the refugees. He's this is the former Sagittaran freedom fighter who represents all of their grievances: you'd think he could've stepped up.

Finally, I agree about not understanding Zarek's concern over Baltar. While I imagine Baltar's trial could reinvigorate a lot of old suspicions about collaborators which were otherwise put to rest by Roslin's amnesty, why would it be so controversial? You'd think all the pro-Baltar types would be lying low, trying not to get caught out.
 

The other thing I didn't think of earlier is the disease itself.

This is an infectious viral disease which is potentially fatal. It can't just have come from nowhere: it has to have been sustained in the fleet somehow for two years since the attacks.

I guess it could be one of those diseases that can survive outside the human body indefinitely, but that's a bit hard to believe.

In any case, with a population size in the fleet of less than 20000, any infectious disease which needs a constant supply of human hosts to survive will probably die out, if it wasn't left back on Caprica already.
 

Y'all should go listen to the podcasts. What we have is a useless episode, because it was meant to set up what would have been a subplot during Baltar's trials, dealing with a massacre of Sagittarians back on New Caprica.

The creators say that - and then say that they dropped that plotline during filming - meaning this entire episode was set-up for something that will probably never be resolved.

(The creators even say that the reason Gaeta stabbed Baltar and why Zarek was so worried was because they were afraid he would finger them as responsible for the massacre. Now we just have some random actions with no pay off).
 

Thanks ivanwolfe. Though given this information I have to say: what the hell? Have they just given up on that whole plotline permanently, then?

Surely there must be some revelation that will come up during Baltar's trial, and if it is not the one foreshadowed in at least three different ways already, then what is it?

Presumably this Sagittaran massacre happened before the Cylons came, otherwise Zarek wouldn't be implicated. It does make sense politically, since the Sagittarans were Roslin's constituency during the election.
 

Thanks for the info IW.

This gets me to thinking back to another episode, the one with the cluster and radiation, where they talked about cutting significant amounts of filming. This seems to be a recurring problem. However, by this point, flashing back to some sort of massacre on New Caprica would just irritate me. Linear storytelling has it's benefits. Constantly flashing back is not a good thing.

Spurgeon, he sabotaged humanity's one decent shot at getting the Cylons to stop chasing them and he then proceeded to risk the fleet by shooting his wife thereby giving her to the Cylons. Either one of those is enough to hate the character.
 

Spungen, sorry I misspelled you name earlier.

BSG is starting to feel like Enterprise. There's just nothing interesting.
 

I was going to write a post about this one but I think I'll just comment here.

The whole epsiode was bizarre. It started off like cliche'd Star Trek episode (the primitive weird aliens refuse our advanced help, but in the end we learn to appreciate their culture--wait, that was Babylon 5, or both, or whatever). But then it morphed into this horrible justification of mistrust of doctors and has DIRECT parallels with the nasty blood-libel currently circulating through the Black and African (and Arab) communities that Jewish Doctors are injecting Black babies in Africa with HIV (hard to believe but the acusations are very popular in some communities--plays better than advocating responsible behavior).

Then this bit with the "sectarian violence"?? Why would there be sectarian violence? What sect does Baltar represent? As far as I can tell he's universally despised and has no supporters. Certainly no ethnic group, and he's an atheist (as far as Colonial polytheism goes) anyway??

It shows that Moore really has no grasp on the current situation in Iraq and doesn't understand why things are happening over there.

Sigh.
 

I don't think every set-up has a direct analog in our society. I agree that the Saggitarons most closely resemble Jehovah's Witnesses or another pentacostal sect. Their reliance on prophecy and literal interpretations of scripture make a Muslim/Black metaphor less coherent.

I knew the doctor was a killer because he suffers from Guest Star Disease. There is no reason to introduce a new medical officer unless he needed to be evil.
 

Give me a break. Right, conspiracy. Are you serious?!?
 

Why does Caprica 6 have a baltar like the real Dr. Baltar has a No# 6?

Is this telling us that Baltar is a Cylon?

Or is No# 6 really an angel AND a cylon model...

WHAT THE.......??????????
 

Actually I think it's pretty cool that Caprica has a Baltar in her head too. It's like they had some kind of mental link at the time that she "died" and left a reflection in each other's minds.

But yeah, they're going to keep us wondering if he's a cylon or not.